FM Vs GT - Discussion Thread (read the first post before you post)

[Scaff]

I have the first three Forza games, and each time I've been hyped up by the trailers and such, and disappointed once I got to play it. They're not bad games, but everything I keep hoping gets changed remains the same each time.

Can I ask what exactly it is you wanted to change?

When I started seeing Forza 4 stuff, I became skeptical. The screenshots looked amazing, way better than I was expecting, but when it finally came out, and I saw videos of in-game racing, I realized the graphics were still just as cartoony and bright as ever.

I would have to disagree with that. While FM4 doesn't look as good as GT5 does at its best, they did reduce the plastic wrap effect to quite a degree in my eyes.

The Morgan at the TG test track video I posted a while ago looks better in that regard to any of the past releases.



Let me know what you think.

That is not to say I wasn't disappointed with aspects of GT5 as well, but you can't say I didn't give each game a chance. I was really looking forward to F4, but when I realized it wasn't going to be much different than F3, I decided it wasn't worth it. Maybe I'll get Forza 5,

May I ask if you have tried FM4 or are basing this just on videos or the demo?

I wonder how many of these said motorsports fan actually are there that you know......in comparison to the millions of sim racers. Yup your argument is pretty much invalid.

What exactly are you trying to say here?

Not to mention most of these said fans have come to Forzaplanet but you fail to recognise the 2 plus million people at GTplanet who may have played Forza and just discarded it due to GT5 being there favourite. I know a lot of motorsport fans too and guess what they laugh when you mention Forza (a bit harsh albeit they are F1 and rally fans). To be honest Forza is called motorsportS but the only motorsport it has is road racing and even then it is lacking.

GT Planet has never had two million members and I can assure you of that.

I would also ask how you can posts this, and then this.....

Also your starting to present you OPINION as fact which is a little bit worrying in terms of discussion.

....because guess what you just did.

Both of you cut it out now.

Hahahaha the part about iracing and GT5. What a terrible misquote....if you keep this up you might reach new levels in the delusional meter.

Argue the point, don't attack the member.

Normal conditions it is more sensitive when in terms of throttle whilst turning in GT5 in speeds as low as 40mph.

Increasing radius corner, constant throttle, decreasing radius?

Could you stop being vague and give a specific example. Track, corner and speed. Then what the car does in both titles, which you feel is more realistic and why.

Edited to add - I did forget to mention, and feel it is important in the interest of fairness. While I have never driven a Cobra, I have passengered in one (well built and original spec built replicas) a on three occasions, twice on the road and once on the track.

Accidentally deleted my reply dont even know how pressed some arrow forward button and it was gone. Tell you later in a hurry.

I look forward to it.


Scaff

 

[cuco33]

Also your starting to present you OPINION as fact which is a little bit worrying in terms of discussion.

Hello irony!!!


And actually the official name of Forza 4 is Forza Motorsport 4. Forza has always been single tense 'Motorsport' in title, no 'S' since inception, since the 1st version, on the original fat xbox1. And there are more than just 1 form of motorsport btw. GT5 does have more forms of motorsports but in general they are half assed or feel tacked on, not done well at all.
I say this not being biased Forza fan. I say this as a Forza AND a GT fan because that's what it feels like, tacked on and half assed. Things like NASCAR, missing 1 brand entirely (even after the latest DLC), having only 2 official track locations, no penalty /flag systems, a mediocre special events listings which favors wheel users heavily but how many career events? Feels tacked on. WRC, nothing in career, no official locations, no damage in special events, a handful of licensed cars/Sebastian Loeb, feels tacked on. "F1", I know isn't officially licensed but there's 2 real F1 cars that have 0 events to play (and I don't call the temporary bandaid of seasonal events as a solution so they are primarily time trial or multiplayer only) with only the fictional FGT, a standard btw, having it's own event. Don't get me started on the Top Gear license... Endurance racing with no multiclass racing nor a damage system at all in career (the freakin point of enduros!!), no driver swaps, and for some time they expected you to drive continuously as in 2x 24hr events straight without stopping, leaving you to pause the game and leave the system on standby until you came back to play again, fixed now with a pit stop save but let's not neglect the unrealistic tire wear. Karting, no real karts, nor official karting rules (but I love karting in this game, for me it's not the best but it is a ton of fun).

Just so you know I'm not being biased here... I'm a huge enduro fan in real life and like the night shift (even if it's only on 3 tracks, 2 being real world) and weather (affects performance, limited to 7-8 tracks), and I hope the next Forza game gets this stuff. For me what's sad is that FM4 and ALMS got into a sponsorship (game was promoted on ALMS events) and there's no endurance racing by any means in Forza 4 (outside of the 2.4hr online modes). There are multiclass racing events, and you have ALMS/LMS/enduro cars, and you can have damage selectable in any game mode but no endurance racing (by time/distance), no weather effects, no night shift. Forza 4 is still a better game than GT5, and this is my opinion based on logic, experience, and fun. I still love GT5 but it's the type of love you get from a red headed step child more than a newborn son of yours.

 

[Vaxxtx]

Also your starting to present you OPINION as fact which is a little bit worrying in terms of discussion.

Hahahaha the part about iracing and GT5. What a terrible misquote....if you keep this up you might reach new levels in the delusional meter.

Got anything to add to the discussion other than your OPINION or others' OPINION that FM4 is better than GT5. Didn't think so

I dont really understand your first few paragraphs, sorry.

People who I know and own both, prefer FM4. That is a fact. You dont belong in this category, because like many others, you dont own FM4. Your opnions is just like many others, off videos and what you hear. Oh, maybe played it a buddies, etc. etc. Re-read my statement and understand it, that way you can reply armed with understanding.

And how is this a misquote?

As I said, people form opinions before they play... And yes, I play with a T500RS. Jump into the street MX5 in iRacing then do the same in GT5. I have done this and know what I am talking about. Can you say the same? There is no significant difference between them. And really saying that PC sims have graphics on a par with GT5 is ridiculous.

Right.. iRacing is better because they have industry partnerships?... Do you even realize the connections PD have? For a start the guy who runs the company is a semi pro racer. They have a large list of test drivers regulatory involving SuperGT drivers, that is not to mention the likes of Sebastien Lobe testing out the rally stuff. And then there are the connections to manufactures and even designing some components for production cars.

It is completely nuts to suggest iRacing has it over GT5 because of this. There is no other dev team in existence with the connection to the automotive industry that PD has. Period.

And rim sizes? Do you realize that this is just a variable in a maths equation? They do not actually model a wheel spinning you know. I am quite sure PD could name a variable wheel size and let people adjust it (as Forza has always done), it would not make the slightest difference to the accuracy of the model.

Oh and the lazer tracks? Marketing rubbish and actually means that the devs have never seen the track in real life as they sub contract to a scanning company that promotes buzz words. Compare Suzuka in iRacing and GT5 and then judge the worth of the PC fanboys favorite marketing word.

 

[Terronium-12]

That bit of bold is utter brilliance.

 

[Tornado]

That's... pretty bad, actually.

Got anything to add to the discussion other than your OPINION or others' OPINION that FM4 is better than GT5. Didn't think so

What, pray tell, do you think this thread is about?

 

[Daverytimes]

Forzaplanet is not as biased as this site, not by any means. Mind you it was started with intent folks can go over there from here! Over there the vs thread you mentioned has folks who have played both games quite a bit, some still do (like myself) and we still see the same type of GT fans who have only 'played it at a friend's house' or basing their posts on youtube videos when chiming in with their 'facts', in lines with here.. No reason to cry foul. I think everyone expects bias to some degree but no one should have to deal with 'experts' of a game who have never really played said game

That's because Forzaplanet is not as well established as this site, a proper comparison will be Forzamortosport.net. When Forzaplanet garners the recognition and popularity that GTplanet has it will invite extreme fans of the game it represents. And when you say "Over there they have folks who have played both games" can't that also be applied to here?

I registered here for info and tips for GT5 after lurking here before and during the launch of GT5. I didnt come here expecting a NON bias but I never expected some of the members here to be so closed minded and at times ridiculous. I am sorry man but the amount of GT hardcore here that play FM at a "friends" house and have the nerve to post their "opinion" in such strong standing is ridiculous also I will not even get started ranting about the ones that judge it from youtube videos. Then you have the ones that rant about the great Kaz and the "passion" and "soul" in GT5..get real.

When I played the first GT game it was new to have so many cars from all over the world in a racing game then I moved on the GT2 and then GT3 A spec, hell man I bought the ps2 GT3 race bundle from Wal Mart that came in the red box! I ended up getting an xbox cause I am a gamer I have no allegiance, then I hear microsoft was coming out with a similar game to GT and that game had a name I thought was weird, something called Forza. I gave it a try and was VERY pleased, I expected something similar to GT and got some other features that were NOT in GT. Did that make me become some ridiculous fanboy..nope, I tried GT4 but by the time I did I was pass doing license tests to start a race and the game up rezzed didnt look that good on my HD TV. That being said I didnt count it against the game because I told myself I was late to the party with the game because it was a last gen game so I will look forward to GT5.

Then GT5 came along, I heard and read all the hype about the game and some of the anti FM boys bashing the Microsoft game talking like GT would be the second coming. Still playing FM3 at the time I picked up GT5 and was a disappointed by a list of things that have been talked to death. What made me get bored of the game was the last gen ported cars, terrible career mode, seasonals turned into what is just a time trial, lack of tuning options I feel should be in the game and honestly I feel like the game needs come forward into what I think is THIS generation of game design. I like racing more than a set of certain cars on the 'ring, I like my muscle cars to sound like a muscle car, I like dropping a big motor in this D class car to see what kind of madness will ensue, I like thinking I can grab a Hamann design for this M5 because the factory pain just didn't pop enough, I like the idea that if I get careless and slam into this car I will have some damage, I like cockpit view in every car, I like the even list with many different races to stretch the game out, I like not having to be a certain level to do a race and last but not least I like the fact that ever since the first FM on the OG xbox I have played it until the Next game came out.

We all have bias but to read this thread and some other threads on this website I feel like some GTP users are simply mad. For sakes, I remember when GT5 came out and you would voice a disappointment some users went flame mode on you. Some of the community here makes me not want to visit here often. The most open minded person I see posting here is Scaff he plays BOTH games and has (in my mind) pretty good points when he posts, but most times get a reply (if any) that is not actually addressing or answering what he posts.

If I am FM biased that is fine, I will accept that and I will stand by my opinion that some GTP users are very closed minded.


That is the longest post I have ever written on probably any website.

Whether bias or close minded-ness you shouldn't expect any different, a website dedicated solely to one product will invite all sorts of people. I used to visit the M3 forums and i loved talking about the M3 but the majority of guys over there are so close minded that they refuse to accept or acknowledge any other car except the M3, the same can be said of 6speedonline (Porsche forums) and to a lesser degree Nagtroc (GTR forums)

 

[FuzzyFassbender]

That's because Forzaplanet is not as well established as this site, a proper comparison will be Forzamortosport.net. When Forzaplanet garners the recognition and popularity that GTplanet has it will invite extreme fans of the game it represents. And when you say "Over there they have folks who have played both games" can't that also be applied to here?
....

Of coarse the same "could" apply but the vast majority of the pro Forza posts in this VS thread are from Forza/GT players, with the pro GT mostly coming from GT only players like yourself.
The issue is, as virtual racing enthusiasts, if everyone had the means to buy both platforms, Forza 4 would be getting most of the attention between the two. That doesn't make GT a bad game and that GT doesn't have some strengths. It's just that Forza 4 does so much more right at this point in time. It's called evolution - hardware and software is constantly improving. Both Forza and GT will look like crap in 5 years compared to the latest at greatest at that point in time.

I have GT, it was the reason I bought a PS3, and have had quite a few hours of enjoyment. PD and T10 are making their money, I could care two s**ts of either. It all comes down to which company provides the best experience at any given point in time. It doesn't really matter to me if I power up my PS3 or Xbox. If GT6 blows Forza out of the water, great, I will be playing.

It's very easy to see those with an agenda. They, for whatever reason, feel "obligated" to defend what they own at all costs. They will convince "themselves" that nothing compares to what they own; illogical as that is.

 

[Daverytimes]

Of coarse the same "could" apply but the vast majority of the pro Forza posts in this VS thread are from Forza/GT players, with the pro GT mostly coming from GT only players like yourself.
The issue is, as virtual racing enthusiasts, if everyone had the means to buy both platforms, Forza 4 would be getting most of the attention between the two. That doesn't make GT a bad game and that GT doesn't have some strengths. It's just that Forza 4 does so much more right at this point in time. It's called evolution - hardware and software is constantly improving. Both Forza and GT will look like crap in 5 years compared to the latest at greatest at that point in time.

I have GT, it was the reason I bought a PS3, and have had quite a few hours of enjoyment. PD and T10 are making their money, I could care two s**ts of either. It all comes down to which company provides the best experience at any given point in time. It doesn't really matter to me if I power up my PS3 or Xbox. If GT6 blows Forza out of the water, great, I will be playing.

It's very easy to see those with an agenda. They, for whatever reason, feel "obligated" to defend what they own at all costs. They will convince "themselves" that nothing compares to what they own; illogical as that is.

OK! lets summarize your post. You are saying that a site dedicated to GT has mostly GT supporters who only play GT and only support GT, then you went on to say that the Forza supporters on this sites are the one's who have played both games. So what i gather from your post is that there is no way to prefer GT over Forza if you have both games, mmmmhhh. BTW If i went to forzamotorsport.net will i encounter the same problems you encounter here? (that is to say a site dedicated to Forza having mostly Forza supporters who only play Forza and only support Forza) if so wouldn't that explain what i had been saying?

 

[Vaxxtx]

OK! lets summarize your post. You are saying that a site dedicated to GT has mostly GT supporters who only play GT and only support GT, then you went on to say that the Forza supporters on this sites are the one's who have played both games. So what i gather from your post is that there is no way to prefer GT over Forza if you have both games, mmmmhhh. BTW If i went to forzamotorsport.net will i encounter the same problems you encounter here? (that is to say a site dedicated to Forza having mostly Forza supporters who only play Forza and only support Forza) if so wouldn't that explain what i had been saying?

That is correct. I am sure some do prefer GT5 over FM4, but I dont know any.

Also comparing Forza.net doesnt seem too fair. There isnt a GT5 or other game subform now is there? GTP seems to be open to more than just GT fans...if you have not noticed. Like Fuzzy said most people on this site started with GT.

 

[Scaff]

OK! lets summarize your post. You are saying that a site dedicated to GT has mostly GT supporters who only play GT and only support GT, then you went on to say that the Forza supporters on this sites are the one's who have played both games.

If you are referring to GT Planet then I can quite confidently say that your observation is not correct.

While GT is most certainly what attracts members to GT Planet its far from the sole reason why they stay.

We have a large number of members who either no longer play GT in any form (many don't game at all now) or do not contribute to the GT sub-forums who are still active members of the site.

The size of, and activity found in the Opinions sub-forum is indication of that.

Many come for the GT, but most stay because we have a strong set of rules, enforce them and encourage mature discussion in areas far beyond GT.

I can think of few forums that offer the range of active discussion outside of the sites core target than GTP, and none that enforce its rules as strongly.

I can honestly say that were I, for whatever reason, to stop playing GT I would still be an active member of this site. Simply because GTP is far, far more than GT. As such a comparison to forza.net is totally wide of the mark.

Go and set-up this discussion over at forza.net and see how long it lasts as a thread and how long you last as a member following that. It doesn't matter how polite you make the thread it will be gone. GTP on the other had allows any post and any thread that meets the AUP.


Scaff

 

[FuzzyFassbender]

OK! lets summarize your post. You are saying that a site dedicated to GT has mostly GT supporters who only play GT and only support GT, then you went on to say that the Forza supporters on this sites are the one's who have played both games. So what i gather from your post is that there is no way to prefer GT over Forza if you have both games, mmmmhhh. BTW If i went to forzamotorsport.net will i encounter the same problems you encounter here? (that is to say a site dedicated to Forza having mostly Forza supporters who only play Forza and only support Forza) if so wouldn't that explain what i had been saying?

If you noticed I used words like "vast majority", not "all", and "most", not "all. I am not naive to think that everyone who plays Forza would prefer Forza. Everyone has a different history that may influence preference.

The point I was making is that in this Forza "sub forum" here on GTPlanet many of those with a good understanding of the Forza merits have both platforms. That is how most ended up here in the first place; GT players who looked for a virtual racing experience regardless of platform. Most, not "all", of the posts slamming Forza in this thread are coming from those never "owning" Forza. Most are judging based on "I played at a friends house" or YouTube videos or hearsay.

There is resentment in both camps but IMO many Forza fans, in this sub-forum (cannot speak for those at FM.net) just want to enjoy another virtual racing title and are discussing here as GTPlanet members. It's not a blanket statement, but many GT players don't want to hear what these members have to say. Many GT players truly believe that there is one and only "Real Driving Simulator"
If I only owned Forza, I wouldn't expect anyone to respect my opinion in a VS discussion. Both of these titles are too deep to understand without first-hand knowledge, with similar controls/sound/display, over a long period of time.

Heck, I was not impressed with Forza 4 after playing the demo; expectations skew the initial experience. But boy was I happy that I gave it time to shine

 

[UKMikey]

I've booted up GT5 for the first time in a few months to try out Spec 2.03 and the core game seems to be holding together OK. No more jaggy shadows when starting a race at least. The lighting and shaders are nicer than Forza's in places. I'm stuck on Historic Car World Championship so won't be able to progress any further with A-Spec though.

With Forza 4 there's always a number of things to do, progressing the Event List, brushing up on your Rivals score, trying a new Storefront tune or paint job. With GT I seem to have stalled in my single player campaign and can't find anything else to progress my career as B-Spec doesn't interest me. While realising that other players' mileage may vary I feel the overall design of the T10 single player campaign suits my style of play better.

On the corresponding thread to this one on forzaplanet.net we have at least one person who appears to have joined up never having played Forza in order to promote GT over it. I'm not sure that the opposite is the case on this site given the history of GTP's Forza section.

Like many others I'm a GT user (launch day purchase) who joined to get advice to try and find out why I wasn't enjoying GT5 as much as GT1-4 thinking the fault was purely mine, only to find many people who to my surprise were disappointed as I was with the game. When Forza 4 was released I jumped in with both feet and haven't looked back.

 

[theofilosz]

I've booted up GT5 for the first time in a few months to try out Spec 2.03 and the core game seems to be holding together OK. No more jaggy shadows when starting a race at least. The lighting and shaders are nicer than Forza's in places. I'm stuck on Historic Car World Championship so won't be able to progress any further with A-Spec though.

With Forza 4 there's always a number of things to do, progressing the Event List, brushing up on your Rivals score, trying a new Storefront tune or paint job. With GT I seem to have stalled in my single player campaign and can't find anything else to progress my career as B-Spec doesn't interest me. While realising that other players' mileage may vary I feel the overall design of the T10 single player campaign suits my style of play better.

On the corresponding thread to this one on forzaplanet.net we have at least one person who appears to have joined up never having played Forza in order to promote GT over it. I'm not sure that the opposite is the case on this site given the history of GTP's Forza section.

Like many others I'm a GT user (launch day purchase) who joined to get advice to try and find out why I wasn't enjoying GT5 as much as GT1-4 thinking the fault was purely mine, only to find many people who to my surprise were disappointed as I was with the game. When Forza 4 was released I jumped in with both feet and haven't looked back.

How can you be stuck in A-Spec mode when you can just skip it and do the next events OR do a seasonal or two to get a higher level for the other races. It is just you wanting to get stuck and not do anything in the game.

 

[UKMikey]

How can you be stuck in A-Spec mode when you can just skip it and do the next events OR do a seasonal or two to get a higher level for the other races. It is just you wanting to get stuck and not do anything in the game.

It is just me not wanting to have to grind to get the money and experience necessary to fully enjoy the game I bought. Perhaps you ought to try some other racing games, they do this sort of thing a lot better as far as game progression is concerned.

 

[Vaxxtx]

How can you be stuck in A-Spec mode when you can just skip it and do the next events OR do a seasonal or two to get a higher level for the other races. It is just you wanting to get stuck and not do anything in the game.

Seasonals I found dull. Start in the back, rolling start, and get to the front in a few laps. Can only do it a few times before it becomes mundane.

Hope you find the right car for an event in the UCD in A Spec (like the truck race), whereas I cant just go buy it. I never understood this.

This is call grinding, and I got sick of it in MMO's, I dont need it in a racing game.

 

[tribolik]

Seasonals I found dull. Start in the back, rolling start, and get to the front in a few laps. Can only do it a few times before it becomes mundane.

Hope you find the right car for an event in the UCD in A Spec (like the truck race), whereas I cant just go buy it. I never understood this.

This is call grinding, and I got sick of it in MMO's, I dont need it in a racing game.

Theres only one thing that makes me wonder if FM4 is better than GT5...

If FM4 is such a great game why do you spend more time posting on this thread than playing the game????

Just kidding

 

[Vaxxtx]

Theres only one thing that makes me wonder if FM4 is better than GT5...

If FM4 is such a great game why do you spend more time posting on this thread than playing the game????

Just kidding

3 mins to post from my phone, ipad, or PC, hardly takes up time now does it?

If GT5 is such a great game, why do you spend more time posting in this thread, (and not even owning FM4) than playing it?

Oh, yeah, just kidding.

 

[buickgnx88]

I'm spending time here cause my xbox decided to crap out on me. Guess it's time to start a new game on GTA4!

 

[Terronium-12]

I'm going to be that guy...

Whatever happened GT6mebe's proof of whatever it was he claimed?

 

[Vaxxtx]

I'm going to be that guy...

Whatever happened GT6mebe's proof of whatever it was he claimed?

Good question. I am waiting in anticipation.

 

[GReeK_W1ZaRd]

If I had a Xbox, I'd definately get Forza....im not going to get into details, as many people believe their own facts, but yeah I'd buy Forza, is a great - looking game.*

*Game: The term of game reffers to things that people create in order to enjoy themselves. Also, many games have a more....competitive approach towards the gamers, thus people tend to argue over technicalities. Games are made for pure fun and entertainment since the old times, be it Tetris or Gran Turismo and Forza.

PS to the mods: Im not attaking any members of either games whatsoever, I just felt like posting this.

 

[TokoTurismo]

I love the both of them, both GT and FM. They both share what I love about cars, but they always have cars hidden in one of them, making me want to explore them both for those cars. Very happy I own both. That's what matters most to me. It's just the camparing, uhhh... But yeah, other then that, both of them RULEZZZZ!!!

 

[t.o.]

As much as I tried to like GT5 there's certain things it can't do that just add that little touch. Like you can never have the feel and look of the following vids in GT5. I really did, for some reason, think a livery editor was going to be in GT5. As much as I like to race I like to look at and re-live it also. All the liveries you see in this video was homemade by choupolo or me. Not one livery was pre-made.

 

[Vaxxtx]

I guess this thread is getting slow as more people start to realize GT5 cant compare to FM4.

Take the new FPS improvment in GT5. They take out crowds and flags on the sides in order to improve the frame rate, and GT5 folks are saying ooo thats a good move. In the same fashion T10 didnt include weather to keep a 60 fps and get blasted for it.

LOL.

 

[t.o.]

I guess this thread is getting slow as more people start to realize GT5 cant compare to FM4.

Take the new FPS improvment in GT5. They take out crowds and flags on the sides in order to improve the frame rate, and GT5 folks are saying ooo thats a good move. In the same fashion T10 didnt include weather to keep a 60 fps and get blasted for it.

LOL.

Don't forget about when Turn10 was releasing photos of cars on tracks with no crowds in the stands and how "some folks" were blasting the game before it even came out. It was a great sin then and a sign of how FM4 couldn't hold up to GT5 , now with this info I bet those same people wont make a peep.

 

[vandaliser]

Lol at the crowd jibe. If you asked the average GT5 gamer whether they would like if pd nerfed weather in return for crowds they would tell you to piss off.

after 3 iterations in one generation, the definitive racing franchise is stuck in daylight mode for the forseable future. That's why forza continues to lag behind GT.

One set of devs focus on gameplay variety whereas the other thinks superficial stuff such colouring your cars is important. Different philosphies, different design decisions and hence different market outcomes

 

[Tornado]

Have you actually played a Forza game yet, or are you just talking for the purposes of hearing yourself again?

 

[vandaliser]

Have you actually played a Forza game yet, or are you just talking for the purposes of hearing yourself again?

Aah tornado again. Long time no see. Still moaning about gt5 or have you finally moved on?

You don't need to play forza to see the vast design differences between the two developers. Well i don't need to anyway

 

[Brend]

I guess this thread is getting slow as more people start to realize GT5 cant compare to FM4.

Take the new FPS improvment in GT5. They take out crowds and flags on the sides in order to improve the frame rate, and GT5 folks are saying ooo thats a good move. In the same fashion T10 didnt include weather to keep a 60 fps and get blasted for it.

LOL.

People are leaving it alone because they are playing their games I presume, not wanting to fulfill the strange sense of acquirement you get from being the harbinger of GT failure.


Also I'm pretty sure this is flame-bating but hey what do I know.

 

[SlipZtrEm]

Lol at the crowd jibe. If you asked the average GT5 gamer whether they would like if pd nerfed weather in return for crowds they would tell you to piss off.

While I'd rather keep weather than worry about crowds in GT5 - I wouldn't mind further thinning of the crowds to actually have the particle effects looking decent. Or running a smooth frame-rate. Which, at least with the latter, is something PD is picking up on, judging by new evidence.

after 3 iterations in one generation, the definitive racing franchise is stuck in daylight mode for the forseable future. That's why forza continues to lag behind GT.

...and after only one full iteration in this entire generation, it took over a year for the real driving simulator to realize people drive their cars from, well, inside the car. And even when they did figure this out, the vast majority of the 800+ (last-generation) interiors amount to nothing more than a black cardboard cut-out. See how easy this way of thinking can be?

Define "lag", since one can assume you still haven't actually played FM4. Other than sales numbers, of course - unless we want to head down that old road.

One set of devs focus on gameplay variety whereas the other thinks superficial stuff such colouring your cars is important. Different philosphies, different design decisions and hence different market outcomes

I can't change horns or play dress up in FM4. I can however, do this:

Superficial, indeed.